Half George

Chris: [00:00:00] Oh, hey Chris. Welcome to Half George.

Kyle, it's good to be here.

Kyle: It's great to be here. Are we gonna do this?

Chris: I am ready. Let's do it. I've been ready for a long time.

Kyle: All right, let's get into it.

Chris: First Half George? Here we are. I'm gonna introduce myself. I'm Chris Rathborne and, uh, I've invited to, to do this with Kyle and talk about men and men in their midlife

Kyle: I'm Kyle, I'm in my midlife. Thanks for the invitation to, to join Half George and chat about some of the fun stuff that we go through, on a day to day. I was thinking a lot about why we would do a podcast about men midlife and,

I haven't really listened to a lot of other self-help or, or midlife kind of podcasts. So it's it's really interesting to me to see where we, where we go and what we get into today.

Chris: I agree and I've listened to the, to the Half Betty podcast and I've been inspired by the stories and the women and yeah. It's made me think a lot about [00:01:00] my life where I'm at, and a lot of it's resonated with me, myself. And, um, I'm excited to, to chat with you and share some experiences and where we're at and where we're gonna go.

Kyle: Yeah, absolutely. So uh, the Half Betty Podcast is largely inspired by Betty White. and I know that there's some inspiration be behind Half George as well. with George Burns.

Chris: there is. Well, why don't I give you a little bit of a history on George Burns. I, I remember George Burns, he was, an old man when I was young, but George was, uh, born in eighteen ninety six. And he lived until, 1996. But my first memory of George was, I guess in late seventies in a movie called, Oh God, where he played God.

And, uh, I just remember him with his big glasses and his cigar. And, um, I don't remember much about the movie, but I just remember he was a pretty funny guy, like, like Betty White and, uh, doing a bit of research on him. Yeah, he was, he was very prolific after 50, and he won an [00:02:00] Oscar in 1979 for a movie called The Sunshine Boys, which is another movie I probably need to see.

Um, he was a comedian. he was a dance teacher.

He was in Vaudeville, which most people don't know 'cause it was like a hundred years ago. But Vaudeville was kind of the, the preamble to Hollywood Live, live theater. And, I think most people in Vaudeville got into Hollywood and, um, yeah, he stayed active into his nineties,

Kyle: I can picture him later in his career with a cigar out of his mouth doing a comedy set on Johnny Carson or something, probably in the eighties. Um,

Chris: a, kind of a deep voice and Yeah. He was funny.

Kyle: yeah, yeah, absolutely. I watched one, one section where he was talking about like health. I think he was coming off of like a quadruple bypass or something like that. And there, there he is on Johnny Carson

Chris: Yeah. Cigars that'll do it to you.

Kyle: Cigars. Yeah. Still smoking, smoking away. Definitely. It was a different time for sure,

I think, uh, when I look at George's, that could influence there. There's one that's a little more current than George Clooney, who, has had a [00:03:00] remarkable career in the first chapter of his life, but has done some amazing things since his fifties as well. And I, uh, I know that he's been through some ups and downs health wise as well.

Um, I think he probably hit a real peak, 45 to 50 on his acting career. Um, but he also went through some, real mental health challenges because he was dealing with some chronic pain and he bounced back and in his fifties he turned into a director. He, won his first Oscars. He'd been nominated before, but also built and sold Cas Amigos, tequila.

For over a billion dollars, I think in his mid fifties. And so

Chris: did.

Kyle: But, for me, it's, it really is this, this idea that, you know, I'm 48. Um, I'm probably a few years, a few years younger than you, but, um, we've had a lot of chances to live up till now.

But it's knowing that we have another 30, 40, maybe 50 years on this earth, and there's a lot of fun stuff we can do in that chapter as well.[00:04:00]

Chris: Yeah, I agree. And, um, you know, when you're in your thirties, you don't, you don't think about it. I didn't think about midlife in my thirties, um, or even my forties. And I think when you hit 50, and I'm 54, almost 55. Yeah. It's

Kyle: Yep.

Chris: the reality of your longevity and your lifetime is, um, is kind of in your face.

And, um, it's what you wanna do with that. And, uh, yeah, we're in different stages of our lives. Um, you know, my kids are grown and not grown, but they're, they're outta the house. And, and you've got, you've got little kids, so it's, um, you, it's a different, different phase of our lives, but in a lot of ways we're, we're very similar.

Kyle: Yeah, I, I feel like you could see into my future a little bit in some ways. You've got, you've got daughters, I've got, I've got sons. Um, there's probably some differences there, definitely as a dad, um, and different times when it was gnarly and different times when it was really cool. Um, but yeah, my, my kids are just about to turn nine and they're twin, twin [00:05:00] boys.

Lots of energy. Um, and it's been, uh, I'd say probably for me, the most transformative part of my life is probably based around when, when my kids were born. And I think because I'm in the, the middle of it right now, I've got nine years of experiences since they were, they were born. And I can definitely say that the past nine years were.

Drastically different than the previous 30, 38. So, um, it's, uh, it's been a ton of learning, a ton of focus and, um, just a complete change in priorities when it comes down to, I think, like marriage lets you be a little less selfish For sure. Um, as a guy, kids you selfless. Like they, they're my, they're my number one priority for sure.

Chris: Well, they do. They do. They, they completely change your life and everything you do is, is for your kids and it goes fast. Um, I, I really don't remember my kids when they were really young. Um, [00:06:00] but I, you know, 9, 10, 11, I, those were, those were great years. And, and then before you know it, they're graduating and off to university and, and then, and then things really change.

Kyle: Yeah.

Chris: But it doesn't because you're still a father and you're still always there for them. And, um, it's just different because they're not with you all the time. And, um, and that's been a big change for me. And maybe we'll get into that a little bit more later, but, um, sticking with the theme of, of Half Betty, why don't you, why don't you give me three to five words that best describe yourself.

Kyle: sure. Absolutely. Um, yeah, I think, I think half Betty, half Betty does five words. Um, I'll do, I'll do four. Let's say four.

Chris: Let's do four.

Kyle: Uh, I think the first one that really is a trait of me is inquisitive. I'm a curious guy. I, I, I ask a lot of questions. I definitely observe a lot, uh, usually before I, I chime in. Um, and I constantly [00:07:00] wanna learn more.

I think I often joke, it like, keeps me young at work and it keeps me, um, it keeps me definitely. Involved with my kids because I'm always very interested in what's going on in their life and wanna find out more about what they're doing and all the tech and games and all the stuff they're involved in and sports.

And I, I feel like if I wasn't curious, it'd be very easy just to state the surface, but I always wanna dive in further, which is cool. Um, adventurous. Uh, I'm a, I'm a skier, mountain biker off roader. Uh, I like to try new things and I, I hope that I pass that on to my kids as well. And it's one of these things where it can get a little more painful in your forties to do that kinda stuff.

Um, I definitely don't heal as fast as I used to, but I, I want to keep that adventurous spirit because, um, I think trying new things is spice of life for sure.

Chris: you gotta stay in shape more. So, [00:08:00] I mean, I, uh, I admire all that. I, uh, I did a lot of that in my thirties and forties and had an injury and I don't really do a lot anymore. And it's, you know, probably my own fault for not, you know, not pushing through. But, um, I think being active is, uh, it's amazing and it's, it's great for your kids.

'cause they'll, they, they see that and they wanna be outside. And especially kids these days, you gotta, you gotta get 'em outside.

Kyle: Totally. And it's, it's, uh, it's too easy for them to sit in front of a screen. We, we sit in front of screens way too much and

Chris: We do. We do.

Kyle: I'll admit, addicted to my phone and I can see them heading down that path really quick. So if we don't, I don't stay adventurous. It actually, I think your, their point around health is really key because those adventures that we go on are ski trips or, uh, bike rides.

They, they keep me in the gym in between because it, I can't just go do those anymore. As a weekend warrior, I, I will hurt myself and it takes longer to bounce back. So I spend a lot of extra time keeping active every day. I, I do, I do at least half an hour [00:09:00] every day. And if I didn't do that, it's a prevention piece.

But also I think if I do get injured, it'll help me heal a bit faster and it lets me know my body's limits before I get myself into a situation where I might wanna pretend that I'm 30 again and do something that I probably shouldn't be doing.

Chris: No. And again, you know, in your thirties you don't think about these things. I mean, I was never a big exerciser. I played sports, I played soccer. But, uh, until I hurt myself, I realized that your body, it catches up to you. If you're not, if you're not good to your body early, uh, it will catch up to you. And, um, I know most of my friends are, are pretty good in the gym.

I'm not so much, I've started to a little bit more, but, um, yeah, you, you just, you know, we, we never take care of ourselves. We take care of everybody else first, but we, we, uh, we have to take care of ourselves. And sometimes that's hard to do. Sometimes that's hard to, hard to realize that you have to do it.

And, uh, I've been a bit stubborn with that. But I'm, uh, I admire you for doing that.

Kyle: Yeah, it's, it's a balance thing. And I, I admit like the first, it, it [00:10:00] hasn't, I haven't always been that dedicated, like the first four years of having kids, I definitely wasn't in the gym as much. And I sold my mountain bike and we didn't go skiing that much for the first three years. And I definitely started to feel it.

Um, and when I got back in to, to riding, I, I hurt myself pretty quick and it took six months to heal. And so it was a reminder that I can't just step back out there. And, and I, I gotta say now, after being back at it for a few years, my, I, I have Strava so I can kind of monitor all my fitness stuff and it's great 'cause I can see like, am I, am I slower?

Am I faster? Am I getting better And am, am I staying the same or am I getting worse? And for me it's like at least being able to know where I'm at and being able to maintain it. And my, my riding and my, my skiing is as, as good as it's ever been, probably, which is great. And so I can do that in my late forties, which is awesome.

Chris: And your fifties and your sixties and your seventies probably. So I, you know, you see these, you see these people in the ski hill that are in their eighties and it's, uh, yeah, it's, it's pretty amazing. But, [00:11:00] um,

Kyle: Yeah.

Chris: just being outside and being an active and, you know, we live in a place that's not always easy to do all year round.

So it's, um, you know, you gotta, you gotta get in the gym.

Kyle: Totally. Yep. Agree. Um, two, two more words. I'm patient. I'm definitely the patient side of the relationship. I think it's good to have a bit of yin and yang on the patient side in a relationship because, um, I try not to let myself get too escalated.

It's probably comes down to that inquisitive nature a little bit. I, I try and. I take in more information before I, I jump at situations and I try and keep myself a little grounded. Um, I definitely escalate every now and then everyone does for sure. But I, I, I try and sway to the, to the patient, empathetic side of the equation as much as I can and

Chris: I can relate fully. It's, yeah, that's, you and I are on the same page there.

Kyle: Cool. Cool. And, and I, I think like my, my wife, um, can get a little more excited about stuff and that's a good thing. [00:12:00] Like I think you need to have a healthy tension between excitement and calm or anxiety and confidence and, and it can change and it can bounce between and be a little bit fluid depending on the situation, but it's kind of good to have both so you can kind of see the whole gamut, um, of whatever scenario.

Because a lot of stuff that we do too, like 48, still don't know. Like, there's still new stuff every day. New experiences and new situations and new arguments and new, new information every day. So

Chris: sure. And the world we live in is changing. it can be stressful,I feel like it used to be we were own, own little worlds. And now sort of the whole world is around us and it's constantly feeding us. Stuff, whether it's positive or negative. And lately it's been a bit more negative and, I think if you have a good balance at home with your wife, um, I think that's really important and it's a good balance.

I,

Kyle: Yeah, it definitely helps lay a foundation for sure. And I think the kids, the [00:13:00] kids see it like, so you mentioned there's a bunch of negativity in the world right now, and I don't want to head down that path today,

Chris: no,

Kyle: but the kids feel it. They feel it when we're more stressed about stuff.

And they feel when we're, when we're less stressed and when things are going really smoothly. So as a parent, we want, we don't want our kids to, I don't want my kids to ever be super stressed out because we're stressed out, but at the same time, I don't wanna shield them from all, all the worlds.

Ups and downs because that's how you build a bit of strength and a bit of, bit of understanding that not everything is rosy. So it's a real balance we have to find. And I think that that's maybe another point around having two people, wife and husband, having different perspectives and bring them together really helps, I think, helps our kids see, see that there isn't one way of looking at things sometimes, and sometimes we're totally aligned and maybe, maybe that's a little bit easier for them to digest, but it's not unhealthy to have a couple of perspectives and figure out stuff for themselves.

Chris: No, not at all. ultimately, you know, parents being [00:14:00] together is the number one important thing. I'm happy that I'm in a great loving marriage and, and my kids have always seen that and we've always communicated with them very well and we've, yeah, you wanna shelter your kids from the outside world sometimes, but I think kids nowadays, even at nine, they know a lot.

They, they see a lot. They hear a lot. Um, and I. We, we didn't, we didn't have that growing up. we were way more sheltered from the outside world. Part of that makes me sad. but it is what it is. you know, my girls are much more worldly because of the world that they've, they live in and, um, and it's kind of framed who they are now.

So, and, and they're great. They're great girls. So I It's done them well.

Kyle: Yeah, I, it kind of shifts us more into like a, value driver versus information, like they can get all the information they want Right now it's a question away. They can have a chat with chat GPT and know way more than, than we know as parents. Um, or they can call us on our, on [00:15:00] our crap as well if we're, we're not right on with our answers.

So it's, and, and they do at nine years old? They do, and I definitely, one, one of my, one of my sons more than the other, but they definitely both have access to more information, than we ever did back then. And they see more stuff and I'm sure they talk about more stuff at school and we're, uh, we're just one piece of a lot of noise that they get on a daily basis.

Chris: Yeah. And that's okay. I, that is okay. I'm, I'm quite happy to hear an opinion from one of my daughters about something that is intelligent and logical. Um, and sometimes, you know, throws me off a little bit because it's so right and so honest. And I don't ever remember being that way with my parents when I was, you know, at any age really, until I, maybe I was an adult, but yeah.

I would never have imagined calling up my parents or correcting on something when I was, uh, you know, in my teens or before that.

Kyle: Yeah, my kids went through a phase where they asked [00:16:00] questions about everything before they could read.

And so it's, it's less what's this, what's this, what's this? And more discussions about stuff at a bit of a deeper level. It, it makes 'em a little less reliant on us for, for that information, but I think our conversations get, get deeper. At nine years old, I know that we're having more in depth conversations than we did at that age, for sure.

Chris: And that's incredible. That's truly incredible. And, uh, you're making me think back to when my kids were that age and I I think they were kind of always that way from. You know, I mean, they weren't born into the technology age.

they kind of came into it maybe when your boys were that age. they haven't had their full lives to kind of be molded by information overload, but they've certainly caught up and it's made them, uh, very knowledgeable about everything in the world and things they're interested in, and things that we're interested in as a family.

So it's, it's great.

Kyle: Yep. Yeah, I wanna get into that a little more. The, the last word that I have is strategic.

I think I used to be a details guy. I used to really, really sweat details, but now I, I [00:17:00] can't get into the details unless I know the bigger picture. And maybe that's like, that's just part of growing up at work and that's part of maturing.

Um, and that's part of like being more conscious of the big picture. Like I think thirties I was, felt pretty invisible, um, and didn't have other people maybe relying on me as much. And so whether it's at home or at work, I try and zoom out a lot.

So that's, that's my four words. Um, do you have five words or three to five words that, that speak to you?

Chris: I do, I think I'm gonna use your first one and, and I'm, I'm a listener and I'm an observer. I always have been.

Um, the next thing I'll say is that I'm, I'm funny. I, I think I'm pretty funny and I like to make people laugh. Um, I, I try to joke as much as I can and, um, I like to hear people laugh

Kyle: Yeah. what is life without, laughter.

do you have like a core group of, of friends that you stuck with through the years that you have kind of [00:18:00] like constant banter and call each other on their shit

Chris: I do. And I, I think it's, I think it's, it's important to talk about, and it's a great question because I do, I have a, I have a great group of friends that I've had for, for a long time and, you know, women, women and men. Uh, in terms of my core friends, yeah, I've, a lot of them, I've known for 40 and in some cases 50 years.

And I have one friend who, you know, I've been friends with for 50 years and he's really more like a brother. All of them are brothers, but, you know, um, no, I'm very lucky, I think, to have more than one friend is a gift. And, I cherish.

All the times I get to spend with my friends and their wives and their kids and you know, I've seen all of their kids grow, grow up, and we've spent so much time together and not just for me, but I see how it is for my kids and the relationships they've made with my friends' kids. And, um, it, it is a gift.

And, and I feel very [00:19:00] blessed that, you know, we have some great friends that we try and see a lot. And, um, so yeah, honestly, I, I think if we're talking about mental health, if I didn't have my friends, uh, I think it'd be very different. I mean, your family is your family, but having, having friends is, there's nothing, there's nothing else like it.

Kyle: Yeah, I, I totally agree. And those long-term friends, it can stay pretty light most of the time, but when it needs to get into the, into the weeds, it does and it does quickly and it does effortlessly. And, sometimes there's disagreements, but that's, that spiciness makes it actually more valuable.

I've got kind of two groups. One, one is more of a high school group that's more like high school and sports. And the other one is more my university friends and some friends that I met like shortly after university. And yeah, they're getting up to 40 plus years of friendship and it's, it's amazing.

Chris: there's just a comfort level of being with the people that, that you love. And, um. Whether it's your own family [00:20:00] or your friends.

Okay, so I've only said one word, so let's, let's, um, let's move on. the other thing that really stands out for me is I'm, I'm very service oriented.

I like to do things for others and I always have, and more so now I will do anything for anybody. I love to do dishes and pick people up from the airport. I mean, those are the two things that stand out for me. Um, but

you know, whether it's servicing my clients and my job or, you know, my friends or my family, I, I get great pleasure out of, out of being, of service to people, whatever they need. And, you know, the next to that would be, you know, generosity. I mean, part of that I think is, is connected to service. I mean, you're, you're being generous with your time, uh, with, with asking nothing in return.

And, um, that's what makes me happy.

Kyle: Yeah, that's good. I, I like that theme as well. it kind of comes along that line of selfless, selflessness. It's get a lot [00:21:00] of, a lot of joy when I see other people succeed or, or when you can help other people. And it, it could be time, it could be sharing knowledge, or it could be financial.

But, it's definitely a, a big part of life.

Chris: people always think money and it's, it's great to be generous with money, whatever you can give. And I, I have a lot of generous friends, and they've taught me to be generous financially when I can be.

but I think generosity in your giving of your time and your, your knowledge is, is really what I like to consider is generosity.

Kyle: I like that. That's cool.

Chris: Was that three? Um, let's see here. Um, I, I think you and I are, you and I are aligned pretty well.

Kyle: Yeah.

Chris: we're very much alike, and, we've met each other a few times and, what I tell my wife all the time is. You know, we talk about friends, but when you get older, it's hard to make friends.

And I've, I, I've been fortunate to, to meet a couple people in my later life that have become really good friends, but meeting someone that you want to have a [00:22:00] deeper connection with is, it's not always easy.

Um, and I don't know why that is. It's probably history and high school, university or work, that's where you really get to know people. But meeting somebody cold and then becoming good, good friends, that's something that takes a lot of effort. so yeah, you and I are, you and I are pretty similar, so I can tell that we, we'd be good friends.

Kyle: Yeah, and I,

And I'm very interested in this next chapter because some of my friends, they, they don't live close by. They, they live in, you know, the other end of the lower mainland or, uh, maybe in other, other parts of North America. And, um, so we don't get to see them that much.

I'm interested to see, 'cause I, I think I'm kind of like you. I, I've got my core groups and it's, it is a little tougher to get past surface level outside of it, but I, I, again, time does a lot of cool things.

Chris: I truly believe that humans have to bond somehow. I mean, you have to find a moment or a time, and I've always thought that if you could just get in a car with someone and drive for five hours, you would be best friends at the end of the road trip. You just, because you'd be forced to chat. And, [00:23:00] um, but it's hard to bond with people over a dinner out one night if you've just met somebody.

I mean, you, you know, what do you, what do you do? What do you work, But you're never gonna really get to the core of that person. So, so you need those bonding times and weekends away and,

Kyle: that's what golf and chairlifts were made for. So I even, I have, I have a friend, I have a friend whose brother bought a boat. And boats are an expensive investment. They're not an investment. I mean, they're an investment in yourself and lifestyle, but they're not typically a good financial investment.

And I think, and I don't want to misquote, but um, his justification was, it was a chance to get closer to his family and a chance to bring friends on. And it was a chance to, to bond like exactly what you're saying. And, and I think his ex, his focus was also like his kids were getting older and they were about to go to university and it was a chance for him in their, in their teens, late teens and coming back from university to do trips where they can all hang out, they can wake surf, they have an excuse to go up to late country and, and actually get to spend [00:24:00] time together.

And so as a, it's an expensive way of, of making that happen. But so is having a cabin, so is doing weekend trips, all this stuff. It's an investment in, in those relationships, I think.

Chris: the tho those are the things that I live for. I love, I love those experiences. Um, you know, working is, is what we do to pay the bills but I, I look forward to spending time with my friends and family mostly.

Kyle: a hundred percent.

like life is, we try to live under our means, but we definitely invest in, in experiences for us and the kids. And we try to say yes to those things as much as possible.

Chris: They're the most important. I mean, when you get to be our age, maybe, maybe my age, I don't care about stuff anymore. I, I don't need a new car. I, I don't need new clothes all the time. I, I don't care about that stuff anymore. I would much rather spend the money to go.

Somewhere, and I don't, it doesn't have to be somewhere far away, [00:25:00] but it's somewhere that we can just enjoy that time and then be able to look back at the photos and, you know, 'cause you can't look at photos of new shirts and jeans and get super excited a year later.

Kyle: Yeah, totally, totally true. I, I think it, it doesn't have to be expensive stuff either. Like we, we are, we're, we're in a camping phase right now. We do a little bit offroading and stuff, so we can go into the, into the bush and get our own, our own space. And some of those weekends are a cooler and, and some gas.

And you find a spot and make some memories for sure.

Chris: Sounds like fun. Sounds like a lot of fun.

Kyle: it's fun. I, I, I'm pretty sure my wife would appreciate it more if we rented an RV and did that kind of stuff, but.

Chris: Yeah. You know, I, I like a comfortable bed too. I, uh, yeah. The days of, you know, sleeping on blow up mattresses that maybe not I. Stay blown up all night are, um, are kind of behind me. Um, but you know, maybe, maybe in the next phase of [00:26:00] life, my, my wife likes camping, so yeah, maybe that's something that we need to start doing,

Kyle: Yeah. worth trying. I,

Chris: late for the kids.

But yeah, I don't think we ever took them camping maybe once,

Kyle: yeah. I'm trying to set their baseline at, uh, at stay, stay alive for a weekend in an uncomfortable bed, so that way everything from there looks up and

Chris: Yes. Yes. Well, I think that, again, I'm going off the pattern of half Betty, but let's, let's talk about maybe something that's happened in your life in the last five years that has been kind of not so great. Um, you know, I know I've got something, but, um, yeah.

Kyle: Um, I think the biggest challenges that, that we face in the past five years is just seeing our parents get older and, we've had to have a lot of very real conversations around what that means.

on my side, my parents are both still alive and I know not everyone at our age, um, has that. So I, I wanna make sure that I'm grateful that, that I, I see my parents often and, [00:27:00] and but the reality is, is they're not as active as they were before.

And getting to do those weekend trips and those real deeper bonding things are a little bit tougher 'cause of health and 'cause of maybe not the ability to be able to do what they could earlier. Um, it's also those, those real conversations around like, what does it mean, financially and, and like, every time they go for a doctor's appointment, I, I don't know if they know how much it impacts us because I, my, my dad has a, a number of health issues and he's, he's kind of had some for quite a while now, but the past five years I've really noticed that it's, um, it's more serious stuff and, and he's, he's in his mid eighties now, so, um, it, this is, these are health issues that don't heal anymore.

It's a matter of how, how quickly they get worse. So.

Chris: How you manage them and, uh, you know, emotionally and like you say time. I mean, time is, yeah, time is a big one with parents because you just don't know how much time you have left and, and how [00:28:00] much they can see the grandkids and spend time with the grandkids.

Kyle: Yeah, absolutely. And that I think the, the grandkids are a really good driver for getting to see them more and really prioritizing it because we want our, our kids to have good relationships with their grandparents. And Krista and I are both really conscious of that time.

I know my grandparents passed when I was pr probably like going to university and then right after university. Um, so I, I had a lot of time with them. My, my dad had kids when he was in his late thirties and I had kids in my late thirties, so our generation was pretty tight.

But on Krista's side, we got to meet their great grandparents they unfortunately passed pretty shortly after the kids were born, but that, that was a really cool thing 'cause um, both of 'em got to see their, great grandkids.

it's probably something that we didn't really think about too much more than five years ago. That definitely has been something that we are very conscious of now. And I, I really, I really value the time that I get to spend with my, my dad and, and my mom. Um, and I, I, [00:29:00] I hope they're around for a lot longer.

Um, and we get a lot more time. But we're conscious of it.

Chris: And, and that's a gift too. Uh, I think as you get older, to appreciate that. Is a gift, because I think a lot of us, you know, we don't appreciate time with our parents when we're younger. We just, we just don't, we're, we're, we're busy and our lives are moving fast and we're in school and we're, we're getting married and, and you just, you know, I don't think parents are a priority, um, until you have kids,

Kyle: Yeah.

Chris: I know that when I had kids, you know, the grandparents were very involved and they, they wanted to be involved.

And, um, you know, selfishly you want to be around them more because you've got more help. I can relate a lot with that. And I, I think for me, you know, when, when Covid started in March of 2020, um, that was enough to throw all of us for a loop. And,

Kyle: Yeah.

Chris: but, but my, my dad was sick, um, at that time and, you know, he was [00:30:00] essentially dying.

Um. And to kind of have to go through that during Covid was, was really hard. And um, you know, fortunately he was at home and he wasn't in a hospital because that would've been worse. But, um, you know, it was just, it made, it made things a little harder to, to see him and to be around him. Um, I mean, we did it.

Um, and then he passed away just before the end of 2020. And that was, yeah, that was really hard. Um,we all knew that he was gonna pass at some point, just, um, just not right then. And, um, I just think the double whammy of having a parent sick during Covid was really, was really hard.

And it took me, I, I don't think I'm totally over it yet,

Kyle: Yeah.

Chris: but the, the world's kind of moved really fast in the last few years to to, to kind get through Covid and. [00:31:00] And just, you know, try and get back to normalcy and, um, so, you know, it's been almost five years, which is hard to believe. But, um, you know, fortunately my mom is very healthy.

Um, and I see her a lot. I see her as much as I can. she's close by and I value those visits. And fortunately, she's healthy and I think she's gonna live a long time. But we just don't know. We just don't know.

Kyle: thanks for sharing. I, I think that's a, it's a, it's the most traumatic thing. I, I don't know what I would do if my dad passed.

I think there'll be some [00:32:00] talking in my future.

Ho honestly, I, I don't know what I would do if my, if my dad passed away now, and it, it's a, it's good to have these talks beforehand because, and I don't, I don't know, you super close, Chris, but in a way it's almost a good thing to open up a little bit because I don't know what I would do if my dad passed away.

And I can't imagine what you went through. So thank thanks for sharing. how did you, how did you deal with that emotionally? Because we couldn't see our friends for a while there, and it was, it was tough.

Chris: I think, you know, if you just talk about covid and the effects on all of us and the mental health, I, I would be the first to admit that it really affected me. And it probably still does in some ways,

Kyle: Yeah.

Chris: but for me, I worked in an office every day and I had for most of my [00:33:00] career, and I had a routine.

I'd go to work every day and saw the people I worked with and went out for lunch And then in one day it was, that was it, you weren't allowed to do that anymore.

but I think in retrospect there was some really good things that came out of that, whether it was, spending a lot of time with the family, and fortunately my girls were still at home and going to school.

I can't imagine if they were already at university or somewhere, but I, I think having the family together was number one important. Um, but we're very resilient and we all pivoted and we figured out a way to, to see our friends somehow. having a parent that, was sick.

with a lung disease. I mean, that was a double whammy because he really couldn't go out, he couldn't see a lot of people.

Kyle: Yeah.

Chris: And I don't wanna harp on Covid. I think it was just a time in our lives that changed everybody. And for me, I'm still working from home and I never went back to that normalcy [00:34:00] that I had known for so long.

And that's like a death too. for a while I said, oh, it's fine. And now I'm grieving five years later

Kyle: Yep. Yeah, it was kind of a forced change of perspective and everyone changed all at once on, on how we worked. it kind of chose us for a little bit there. But I, I, I think to come back to your, to your dad, I, I experienced a very similar piece where my dad was immunocompromised, so it was very similar.

he was on some drugs that meant that he was in that risk factor. So we had to be very careful about seeing him. And it was tough to, it was tough to. Know that we couldn't see it, but it was also like, it was kind of for me, the start of a change where, I always thought that he would justget better

But we started to realize that there were people that were succumbing to this, and it was a real risk, a real morbid risk. And we never really had to face that head on before. Um,

Chris: Was he at home?

Kyle: he was, he was at home. He was at home, and my mom's super healthy. So he, he had, he had her around and we definitely, we did it, we did what everyone did.

We, we met in, or we would [00:35:00] park at the top of the driveway and the kids would sit in the back of the car and they were at school, so just starting school. So my parents were rightfully scared to have them anywhere near, so they had to see their grand with their grandkids for a year or two. From a distance.

And so, so that was, that was a very interesting adjustment. I've been through a few things earlier in life where, it taught me that talking about these major events is probably one of the best ways to heal. Um, and sometimes, like, especially during Covid, it was tougher to talk to people. So like, did you, did you end up doing any therapy or did you like when you were spending time with family, were people open to talk about it? 'cause sometimes people just want comfort in being with their friends and family, but it's the talking, I think that helps you rewire your brain and remember the good and, and kind of get closure and all that kind of stuff.

Chris: I've certainly been to counseling before,

yeah, I think it, I think it gave me the tools to talk about things. I feel very [00:36:00] fortunate that my whole family is very open and y you know, I've always been able to talk to my mom about things.

Um, very open and honestly, and I think it's just gotten better, um, because it had to be, I mean, she, she, she's the only one there now. So it's, you know, my, my dad was a little less, I think he was a little less open with his feelings and, and communicating certain things. And that's probably where I get maybe my, my shyness from.

Kyle: I think that the hardest part is I. If you're having problems coming out of it. So if you're stuck in a spot where it's mostly having memories and maybe negative and, and crying, that, that's when you need to talk even more and be open with other people and maybe get some help

Chris: You know, I think that I, yeah, talking, talking is really important and I've, I've learned fortunately how to, how to share my feelings and it's hard. It's really hard. my first idea is to not talk about [00:37:00] things, but I always find that when I do talk about things to anybody, uh, that it always helps.

so I'm much more open to just bringing stuff up. Uh, and it, and it always, it always goes in the right way. Um, but there's a lot of people that don't talk about it. And, um, I think in terms of having a, having a parent pass away, I'm okay to process those feelings on my own.

And, and again, I have a family that's pretty supportive, but, you know, if I was alone, I, I think I would go to a dark place. I really do. So I think. Again, going back to having great friends and a great, great wife and a great family is that's therapy in itself.

Kyle: Yeah. I agree. I mean, and I think it's, it's cool that you have, have been to some counseling before. If you have the tools, then you can have the conversations with other people. Um, so if you've seen a good counselor, it can help provide that foundation.

I know I use a lot of the, the tools and the, you know, the cognitive behavioral therapy kind of psych, breaking the cycle kind of, kind of tools and [00:38:00] relaxation tools that, that I probably learned 20 years ago, um, doing some therapy after a bad car accident. And it's helped me to this day and it's helped me actually probably be more empathetic to people that have ups and downs versus in my twenties, uh, I wouldn't have even known the how far down you can go.

I feel like I lived my life a little flatter. Back then peaks were a little bit muffled and the lows were a little muffled. Now I feel more open, I try and let the, the ups and downs come, but you have to have tools to deal with the downs for sure. And, um, there's lots of causes of, of downs.

It could be work, it could be, it could be family health, it could be financial. It could be your kids doing something who, who knows. Um, but every day is a new day. And, and we take the, the good with the hard, right?

Chris: I agree. I. Sharing it with someone always helps, but you can't share everything. There's some things you have to, [00:39:00] you have to sort of figure out in your head, again, whether it's work or financial or relationship or, um, but yeah, tomorrow is always, it's always a fresh perspective.

And, and usually it, you know, you think it through and it, and it, and it usually works out. Um, sometimes you gotta dig a little deeper and, um, certainly there's, you know, people use other means to, to cope with those issues. Fortunately, I, you know, I don't, I don't need those things. I don't need to rely on alcohol or, or drugs to kind of calm any bad day.

Um,

Kyle: Yeah.

Chris: and I'm too old for that stuff anyways. It just, you know, it just doesn't really work for very much anymore.

Kyle: Uh, it's, you know what? Honestly, it's, it, I think it's worth talking about a little bit, but maybe it's, maybe it's for, for another time. But, uh, alcohol used to be a fairly big, big part of my social scene and, um, and now for, for health reasons and for just, uh, the impact it has on my body and the, the length that it takes to recover from having a few drinks, it, it definitely changes in your late forties.

Chris: it's not worth [00:40:00] it. No, no, no. It's, it's, it's just, it's not worth it. I like to wake up and not have a headache.

Kyle: That's it. I, I can't remember the last time I slept in past noon or past. Seven or eight for that matter. And when I was younger, you had that luxury so you

Chris: Well, seven or eight's good. Wait till you're 55 and it's like five 30 or six. So it's, uh,

Kyle: So we, we kind of talked about some challenging negative scenarios in the past five years. Maybe it'd be good to end on something that changed that's, that's, that you've got a positive spin on.

Chris: Well, I think the first thing that comes to mind is, I'm gonna say work.

knowing I work for a really supportive company has been a real positive. And, companies aren't perfect, but I would say that I really lucked out 'cause I didn't know what to do.

I mean, you know, you got Covid, you know, your company goes bankrupt. Um, you know, your fa your father's dying. I, I, I was dealing with a view of things in a short period of time. But,

Kyle: Sure.

Chris: I think the gift of landing with a company [00:41:00] that really, um, is supportive has been a real gift.

I mean, that's the work side. I. the other positive is I, I gotta spend a lot of time with my kids. and more so than I would've if Covid didn't happen. Because when you think about it, the amount of time you were spending away from home and, you know, yeah, they're in school and stuff, but it's those hours in the beginning, at the end of the day that I, I got to spend with my girls and, my oldest left for school in 2021, and then I got, three years with my youngest and I was home.

I, I was home all the time and that was a real gift. To just be home for her in those three years. But also, I, I didn't have to travel, I didn't have to do anything else. And so, I'm gonna go with family first. let's say that for sure. that was the biggest gift that I always remember coming outta Covid specifically, was, was the amount of time I got to spend with my family.

Kyle: that's really cool. And I'm on the same page there, a little bit of a different [00:42:00] timeline. during Covid I was working for a growth startup in the music technology industry that went fully remote. Um, but then coming out of Covid, I went to a company that was very progressive in bringing people back to the office.

And I thought it was great because I, I started with the company and I got to build those relationships really quick 'cause we were face-to-face and it was all going really well, but I missed out on family. And I realized after I, I left that company, exactly a year ago. Um, and for the past year I've been doing a remote startup and doing some product consulting from home.

And I've got to see my kids in afterschool sports. I've got to drop them off at school. I've got to go see their teachers. Like all the stuff that I wanted to be there before, but there's just no way to make it happen. I was working downtown, so it was basically, I was leaving at seven o'clock in the morning and getting home at six or seven.

And, and my kids were going to bed at 7:30/8:00. So, you end up missing so much. I didn't even realize how much I was missing. And [00:43:00] then the past, past year has been amazing. Yeah.

Chris: Yeah, so much. Yeah. I think,for men mostly, there's a lot of women, but yeah, I think for a lot of men, that's their lives. they don't get to see their family and they're working a lot. And I'm glad I've never really been in that kind of role.

So, I'm happy for you. that's amazing.

Kyle: Yeah, and I think that there's a big push to get people back in the office, but I love the hybrid model. I feel like that's gonna provide the flexibility, but also bring people in to be accountable face to face, and let people schedule a more balanced life. And, I think that's, it's a constant battle balancing family, relationships, work, health, all that kind of stuff.

Um, but if you have a bit of flexibility in your work where you're spending the bulk of your life during the day, it makes it a little bit easier to, to do all that other stuff.

Chris: I agree.

Kyle: yeah.

Chris: Wow. we've covered a lot. that was great. I appreciate it.

Kyle: Yeah.

Chris: All right. Kyle,

Kyle: Thank you very much. [00:44:00] Chris.

All right. We'll talk to you later.